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#12 2011-03-24 17:30:23
- Gabryelle
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Re: Perus cu picioarele umflate
Buna ziua. As dori sa stiu daca cunoaste cineva un medic pentru perusi bun in galati...si in speranta ca cineva mi-ar putea da un sfat care sa il ajute pe puiu meu,am sa scriu simptomele lui. De vreo trei saptamani am observat ca il dor piciorusele si nu are stabilitate in ele. Alte simptome: la varfu unui deget de la piciorul stang are o umflatura galbuie (ca o coptura) care a spart si a iesit puroi cu sange,umflatura s-a mai micsorat dar tot o are...amandoua piciorute au niste pete galbui chiar si pe partea de sus pana unde incep penele,sunt fierbinti,sta mereu retras,nu prea mai vorbeste. Va rog,astept un sfat de la cineva care a mai avut aceste simptome cu perusul lui.
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#13 2011-03-24 19:37:12
Re: Perus cu picioarele umflate
Nu stiu niciun doctor priceput in Galati. Problema puiului tau pare serioasa si trebuie sa faci ceva repede. Sfatul meu e sa-l suni pe dr Tudor este din Bucuresti, roaga-l sa-ti dea un sfat prin telefon pt ca esti din Galati, noteaza-ti pe o foaie de hartie toate simptomele si roaga-l sa te indrume cumva. Nr de tel e 0744 585 321. Insista daca nu raspunde de prima data pt ca e f ocupat! Uite, pentru rani stiu ca exista o solutie special pentru perusi: sanipur w. Sanatate multa, ai grija de puiut si tine-ne la curent!
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#14 2011-03-24 20:10:09
Re: Perus cu picioarele umflate
Vezi daca nu cumva o poti pansa cu pansament din acela care contine si medicamente (taie o bucatica de pansament si incearca sa o infasori usor peste rana)... doar daca se poate, s-ar putea sa o perusul sa se si agite, sa se sperie si sa dea din picioruse. Ideea e o impiedici sa apara vreo infectie pentru ca atunci e grav de tot. Mentine o curatenie stricta in colivie.
Pana la urma nu e chiar asa grav daca vorbesti cu dulapul. Mai rau e cand si dulapul vorbeste cu tine.
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#15 2011-03-25 00:58:57
- adita
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Re: Perus cu picioarele umflate
un bun dezinfectant si cicatrizant mai sunt tinctura de iod sau albastru de metil . fa-i un culcus moale pe fundul coliviei eventual ca sa stea acolo in caz ca il dor piciorusele
" speranta moare ultima "
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#16 2011-03-28 12:16:14
- Gabryelle
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Re: Perus cu picioarele umflate
Va multumesc pentru sfaturi. L-am dus azi la al doi-lea doctor si pare ca se pricepe mai bine dar din pacate nu are ce sa-i mai faca. Are guta si este incurabila... copilasul meu are 11 ani si toata viata lui i-am dat numai vitakraft pentru juniori iar asta se pare ca i-a provocat aceasta boala.
Va recomand celor care inca mai dati perusilor adulti mancare de juniori sa le schimbati mancarea cu cea pentru adulti. Stiu ca multi perusi sunt pretentiosi si fac mofturi dar mai bine 3,4 zile de infometare decat aceasta boala. Acum nu-mi ramane decat sa-i fac traiul mai usor...recomandari pentru guta: multa salata verde, fructe, legume. Nerecomandat: oua de orice fel..inclusiv cele din mancarea cumparata. Doctorul la care l-am dus se numeste Dan Georgescu din Galati. Poate mai cauta cineva vreun veterinar prin Galati. Va doresc multa sanatate la peruseii vostri si sa aveti grija de ei.
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#17 2011-03-28 15:48:50
- Gabryelle
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Re: Perus cu picioarele umflate
Am gasit pe un site din afara un posibil tratament pentru prelungirea vietii in caz de guta la perusi. Problema este ca nu cunosc toti termenii in engleza si as dori sa apelez la voi poate este vreun binevoitor pe aici care se pricepe sa traduca acest articol...poate va fi de ajutor si altora cu aceasta problema.
What Treatments Might My Veterinarian Suggest
If My Pet Bird Has Gout?Increase The Bird's Fluid Intake
Birds, by design, do not consume a lot of water. Water adds weight and weight limits flight. But the more urate-containing urine your bird produces, the less likely urate is to precipitate out in its body as crystals. Your birds urine is the white, chalky material and surrounding liquid that encircles the brownish stool when it plops. Many owners mistake increased urine for diarrhea.
If your pet is debilitated when you first bring it to a veterinarian, the vet may give the initial fluids by intra-abdominal or intraosseous (in the bone) injections. That often perks them right up. These fluids also help flush out some of the urates. Some pets are helped by fluid injections whenever they have a relapse.
Getting your pet to drink more is not easy. But if the bird is fed fruit, juicy vegetables and sprouts, it's total water intake will be greatly increased over a pellet/seed diet. Add an additional water container or two to its cage as well. Many birds with gout have difficulty moving about, so the water sources should be as close to the bird as possible. Try containers of different shape, depth and color and add ladders and ramps to assist the bird in getting to them. Increased urine output is particularly important because birds can not concentrate their urine nearly as much as mammals.
Modify The Bird's Diet Lower Protein Levels
Some pet owners and all marketers have a tendency to think that if a little of something is good - a lot is better. We all have that subconscious urge. However, fruit and seed-eating birds were not designed for a high-protein diet. In the wild, the majority of their calories come from carbohydrates.
Most avian diets on the market are based on the abnormally high protein needs of overworked chickens destined for short lives. Some folks justify the high protein levels in parrot diets by stating that wild parrots also eat high-protein grubs. If this occurs at all, it is in insignificant amounts. When your pet bird starts crowing like a chicken, feed it high protein like a chicken. High protein diets cause high uric acid levels.
Changing an ill bird's eating habits can be very difficult to nearly impossible. Birds that have been eating a seed diet are very resistant to eating fresh foods. But it is very much worth your effort to try. Any diet change you make need to be done gradually. Start by adding appropriately sized new fresh fruit items to your pet's food cup. You can place some on the floor of its cage also - if your pet is still able to walk.
At first , diced the fresh produce small. Birds can be intimidated by large objects in the dish. You can offer: collard greens, mango, papaya, sweet potato, yellow squash, pumpkin, yam, zucchini, cantaloupe, dandelion, red chili pepper, and leaves from the stem of broccoli and cauliflower, cabbage and turnips - just about anything on the produce isle.
Remove stale vegetables at the end of the day. Be sure to wash all produce well before giving it to your bird and do not provide a very large amount of any one item. The color and consistency of the stool of your bird will change rapidly depending on the color and consistency of what it eats. Don't be frightened by this.
In addition - offer your pet sprouts. Any edible small seed from a health food store can be sprouted. Seeds designed for gardeners and farmers have toxic products added to them. Do not attempt to sprout those.
Periodically weigh birdie to be sure it is not loosing weight unless it ought to.
Medications That May Help
Allopurinol (Zyloprim)
Allopurinol and drugs with similar actions such as Uloric have been used in birds in an attempt to reduce uric acid level in gout. However, results have not been satisfactory. The reason allopurinol and similar drugs are given to human gout patients is that they blocks purine synthesis the major source of uric acid in mammals. But birds are not mammals and the majority of the uric acid in their blood comes from other sources. Birds need to make uric acid to cleans their body of protein wastes. So even if allopurinol were to block uric acid formation in birds, it is unclear that that this would be good for the bird. In the only controlled study done in birds, allopurinol at a substantial dose actually caused gout in birds. In a second study at a lower dose, allopurinol did not lower blood uric acid levels.
If medications were effective in preventing your pet from producing uric acid, the building block of gout, we would face another big potential problem. How would your pet dispose of the waste products of its metabolism? Mammalian animals and you and I do it by excreting urea through our kidneys. But we do not think birds can do that. Most scientists do not think that birds possess that ability (ref) , probably because they lack a necessary enzyme in their liver (ref) . Normal birds do have a little residual urea in their blood, but it is there for a different reason (ref).
Probenecid (Benemid, Benuryl) Uricosurics:
Uricosurics are drugs that increase the amount of uric acid flushed from the body through the kidneys. In Humans, probenecid enhances uric acid excretion and the frequency of attacks. Veterinarians have used it, hoping for the same effect. I know of no scientific evidence that it has the same beneficial effect in birds whose uric acid metabolism and anatomy is quite different from mammals. There are no scientific studies that I know of that documented that it is helpful in birds with gout. Uricosurics work by increasing the concentration of uric acid in the urine of mammals who can produce quite concentrated urine 20-25 times the concentration of their blood). But birds are said to only produce urine 2 2.5 times as concentrated as their blood (ref). (requested desert quail article with the 20-25 time quote 4/24).
Colchicine
Colchicine is a potent anti-metabolic chemical that has been suggested as a gout treatment for humans for 2000 years. . There is an article that suggests it limits the inflammation caused by gout crystals in chickens (ref). Although it is a drug with numerous side effects, it was FDA approved for the treatment of gout flare-ups in humans in 2009. It seems to work by decreasing the amount joint inflammation caused by the uric acid crystals - not decreasing the number or size of the crystals. I have no personal experience using it in birds.
Metacam (meloxicam) Celebrex (celecxib), Aspirin and other NSAIs
Pet birds that have articular gout are often lame, have difficulty getting about and may be in pain. They also often pull out their feathers perhaps due to the pain of inflamed joints. So veterinarians and owners are understandably tempted to give them pain-relieving medications.
These pain-relieving medications are generally non-steroidal anti-inflamatory agents (NSAIs) - the group of drugs that includes aspirin, meloxicam (Metacam), and Celebrex. All of the NSAIs decrease blood flow through the kidneys. They can be tough on human kidneys (ref) - but they are much much harder on the kidneys of birds. One NSAI in particular, diclofenac, is known to be extremely toxic to the kidneys of birds. But other NSAIs ( metacam, indomethacin, flunixin and ketoprofen also injured the kidneys of birds (ref 1, ref 2).
You will have to make the decision whether or not to give your pet a NSAI. It will be a trade-off of possibly giving your pet better short-term mobility vs perhaps a longer, but more painful, survival. The same trade-off applies when corticosteroids are given.
Sodium Bicarbonate And Other Urine Alkalizing Agents
The normal pH (acidity) of bird urine is 6.5-8, depending on diet and other factors. We know that uric acid crystallizes more at lower (acidic) pH. So some veterinarians suggest that birds with gout receive sodium bicarbonate or other alkanizing medications to maintain a more neutral urine pH. However, altering blood pH to any significant extent can be fatal. And it is normal for urates to form crystals in your pet's urine.
Physical Treatment
Some cases of articular gout are accompanied by itching and pain - particularly in cockatiels when the wing joints are affected. When this occurs, a restraining Elizabethan collar might help the bird from causing further chewing injury to itself. I feel quite sorry for birds forced to wear them for long periods - I wouldn't want to - so I rarely recommend these bulky collars.
Some gouty birds appreciate added heat and humidity. You can supply a heat lamp - but be sure that the bird can move away from it if it becomes too hot and dont let them chew the cord.
Because many birds with gout have difficulty using their feet, they appreciate your replacing their standard perches with perches that are wider in diameter as well as ladders that allow them to climb with their beaks. Their toenails may need to be trimmed and shaped more frequently as well. Add additional water containers and food dishes of varying dimension so the bird does not have to travel far to drink and have the bowl sides low enough so the pet does not have to perch on the rim.
Hand feeding often overcomes weight loss. It also allows you to increase your pets water intake. Veterinarians know that low fluid intake and dehydration favor the development and progress of gout.
Natural Remedies
Omega-3 and Omega-6 fatty acids
Omega-3 fatty acids have been recommended for just about every medical condition known to man. I used to be quite skeptical that any compound could be effective for everything, but I have seen publications that are changing my mind (ref 1, ref 2). The most acceptable explanation for me is the one that equates their beneficial effects to their ability to decrease inflammation in any part of the body. So go ahead and give them but in moderate, appropriate amounts. I suggest you use an oilseed/nut source rather than fish oil.Some owners feel that feeding their gouty pet birds cherries or cherry juice or one of the many folk remedies suggested for humans help their pets. I love cherries myself, they contain anthocyanins, which are thought to reduce the pain and inflammation of human gout sufferers. If you use these natural remedies, use them in small, sensible amounts for a critter as small as a bird. If nothing else, you bird might enjoy the variety.
What Is The Outlook For My Bird - Can Gout Be Cured?
By the time most avian patients reach veterinarians, their gout and kidney disease is quite advance. But if you change your birds lifestyle early in the disease and get it through its current crisis, perhaps its remaining kidney function will grow as it does in humans. It may even reabsorb some of its gouty plaque crystals if its blood uric acid levels can be kept consistently low.
Periodic uric acid monitoring in these pets by your veterinarian is a good idea. However, the blood must be withdrawn at the same time subsequent to consuming a diet of similar quantity, protein content and protein source if any meaning is to be made of the results. You will find a table of bird uric acid values reported from zoos throughout the World by following the link I mentioned earlier. I did not include values based on very small numbers of birds and I picked out the species I thought might include your pet. Remember, removing a blood sample from a bird weighing under 60 grams or a debilitated bird is not without risk.
I have noticed that blood uric acid levels in birds tend to increase as birds age. I do not know if this is a general phenomenon in parrots, ( Our BUN does go up as we humans age) or if it was just more likely that zoo veterinarians were asked to take samples from ill birds than from healthy ones.
Feed Variety
Feed a variety of foods. Feeding a monotonous diet of limited ingredients is unwise. The birds becomes bored and the chances for dietary imbalances become greater when only a few food ingredients are relied on. The more different foods a bird eats, the healthier it will be and the longer it will live. You can read more about that here.
Encourage Your Pet To Exercise
Encourage your bird to exercise. Most commercial cockatiel, parrot and parakeet cages are much too small. Birds were not designed by God to walk from place to place. For their circulatory system to function well, they need to fly - or at least flap. Letting your bird fly loose in your house can be very dangerous. But you can build a flight cage. The cage must be long, but it does not have to be wide or deep. (Big parrots and macaws do not like to fly if they think their wing tips might brush up against objects).
Flighted birds are also in danger of escaping or crashing into windows, fans and mirrors. Clipping enough of the secondary wing feathers so the pet can only fly a few feet will solve this problem. Do not clip only one wing as this gives the bird a tendency to roll. Conures and macaws can fly with less wing feathers than amazons. I occasionally imp flightless parrots to get them off the ground the same as falconers do. They just love to preen their new feathers even when I use cockatoo primaries on parrots or vice versa.
Natural Sunlight
Expose your bird to natural sunlight for at least one hour a day. If the light passes through window glass, the important UVB rays are lost. Exposure to natural sunshine allows the bird to re-establish it's normal body rhythms and produce adequate amounts of vitamin D3. If you can not do that in a partially shaded area where the pet will not overheat, utilize full-spectrum lamps designed for reptiles. Just be sure the birds cannot gnaw the cords.
Encourage Water Consumption
Encourage extra water intake by having multiple water containers of different color and shape. Feed fun fruits and vegetables that are high in water.
Avoid Easy Fixes And Miracle Cures Sold Over The Internet:
Owners never have long-term success when they attempt to use vitamin supplements and wonder potions as a substitute for good diet, husbandry and sound veterinary care. With proper diet, these supplements are unnecessary and they are sometimes harmful to your bird's health. If you peel away the onion, these remedies are always peddled by folks with no knowledge of how the avian body works. The best you can hope from these products is that they will do no harm. I know that is hard for my clients to accept. I have loved all the parrots I have owned and I miss every one of them to this day. Just like you, I would give anything to have them back.
If you feed and care for your buddy in captivity as close to the way God intended, and love and interact with it, it should live to the ripe old age the Maker allocated to it.
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#18 2011-03-28 21:58:47
- adita
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- Din: bucuresti
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Re: Perus cu picioarele umflate
uite ceva in romana despre guta
Guta este de doua feluri si anume guta de incheieturi si guta de intestine. Guta de incheieturi este mai usor depistabila deoarece se formeaza noduri galbui pe piciorusele pasarilor. Guta de intestine duce de o bicei la moartea pasarii deoarece se depisteaza deobicei doar la sectionarea pasarii sau atat de tarziu incat functionalitatea rinichilor este redusa deja incat nu se mai poate face nimic pentru pasare. Aceasta boala apare mai ales la perusi dar si la nimfe. La guta de incheieturi, simptomele sunt foarte vizibile, noduri la degete, miscare greoaie, papagalul incearca sa se culce pe bete sau pe fundul coliviei pentru a evita greutatea pe picioare, picioarele sunt de obicei calde si umflate si violete. La guta de intestine sau rinichi nu apar de obicei simptome pana la moartea pasarii. Guta apare daca functiile de filtrare ale rinichilor numai sunt intacte, ceea ce duce la cresterea acidului uric in sange. Acestea se depun de obicei la incheieturi. Boala apare de obicei din cauza lipsei de vitamina A, mancare cu prea multe proteine, lipsa de apa. Cura pentru aceasta boala nu prea exista, in schimb se poate influenta decursul bolii. De exemplu visinele ajuta foarte mult, nu conteaza ca sunt proaspete, au fost inghetate sau este doar suc de visine.
incearca sa il suni pe Dr Laurentiu Tudor 0744.585.321 si sa iti dea un sfat ceva si sa iti spuna ce fel de mancarica sa ii dai ...
Ultima modificare de adita (2011-03-28 22:13:16)
" speranta moare ultima "
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#19 2011-03-29 09:27:30
- Gabryelle
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Re: Perus cu picioarele umflate
Din pacate puiutu meu a murit asta noapte. Daca mai vrea cineva sa traduca acel articol pentru altii care mai au aceasta problema, puteti sa o faceti.
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#20 2011-03-29 20:24:48
- adita
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Re: Perus cu picioarele umflate
off imi pare rau
dar cred ca poti spune ca si=a trait viata la 11 ani .
" speranta moare ultima "
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